In a first since the war began, Ukraine launched an invasion into Russia

Transcript

SCOTT SIMON, HOST:

Ukraine shocked Russia this week by launching a substantial invasion into Russia. Ukraine's cross-border incursion into western Russia is now in its fifth day. Russia appears to be struggling to mount an offensive counterattack. NPR's Greg Myre joins us from Kyiv. Greg, thanks for being with us.

GREG MYRE, BYLINE: Hi, Scott.

SIMON: How did Ukraine manage this - sending a large ground for straight across the Russian border in the middle of a war?

MYRE: Yeah. Ukraine clearly identified a vulnerable spot on Russia's western border. Russia clearly wasn't paying attention. And Ukraine sent these ground troops rumbling across its northeastern border in armored vehicles - nothing hidden here - into western Russia on Tuesday morning. The Ukrainian forces are at least 6 miles or so inside Russia's Kursk region, and we're getting all sorts of reports that small units may have penetrated much deeper.

The Ukrainians are operating in or have taken control of numerous villages and at least one town. Videos on social media show a burned-out column of Russian military vehicles, dozens of Russian soldiers surrendering, large numbers of Russian civilians fleeing by car. Now, neither Russia nor Ukraine is saying much. So we're trying to put this together like a jigsaw puzzle, where we only have a small number of the pieces.

SIMON: Just a week ago in this program, we were talking about the Russian offensive in Ukraine. How's Russia responding now that it's on the defensive?

MYRE: Well, in a word, struggling. Russian leader Vladimir Putin has been holding meetings with top national security officials at the Kremlin. Some of this has been televised in an attempt to reassure Russians. And the military officials are telling Putin that troop reinforcements are on the way, that they're defeating the Ukrainians and they'll regain control of the border very soon.

Putin is clearly unhappy in some of this video. And these reports appear to be way too rosy. Russian military bloggers are saying the fighting is not going well for Russia. They describe the Russian response as chaotic. The panicked civilians are fleeing. And the Ukrainians seem to just keep attacking.

SIMON: Do we know what Ukraine's goal is with this high-risk operation?

MYRE: You know, Scott, we don't. What we have right now is just a lot of speculation. Now, in remarks in his nightly address, Ukraine's president, Volodymyr Zelenskyy, said, quote, "Russia brought war to our land and should feel what it's done." So there's definitely this psychological component of what's - of going on the offensive, raising morale in Ukraine, which has indeed happened, and putting Russia on the defensive, which has also happened.

Now, we only have hints of the possible military strategy here. I spoke with one of Zelenskyy's top advisers this week. His name is Mykhailo Podolyak. He said Russia has been attacking from these border areas without fear of retaliation on Russian territory and that needs to change. Here he is speaking through an interpreter.

MYKHAILO PODOLYAK: (Through interpreter) We have to push them back in some areas if we want to make those areas safe for us. And we are creating this buffer zone.

MYRE: So I would just add, Scott, that it could be extremely difficult to hold on to Russian territory if the Russians make a big push to get it back, which they seem to be doing.

SIMON: And, Greg, how's the fighting that's going on inside Ukraine going?

MYRE: Yeah. Ukraine is still on the defensive at home, and it's struggling to halt, or at least limit, a Russian offensive in the eastern Donbas region. The Russian forces have seized a number of villages in recent weeks, making it one of their more successful ground operations in well over a year. The Russians just send wave after wave of troops towards Ukrainian lines, and they've been suffering massive losses with these attacks. But they have advanced. And, Scott, we're just at this rare moment in the war, where both the Russians and Ukrainians are on the offensive at the same time, though, obviously in different places.

SIMON: NPR's Greg Myre in Kyiv. Thanks so much for being with us.

MYRE: Sure thing, Scott. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.